http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RUgHMJRWnlg" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
full interview up at http://www.ancreport.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
or it will be in an hour
Podcast 5 Obamacare why it sucks
Podcast 5 Obamacare why it sucks
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Re: Podcast 5 Obamacae why it sucks
Philip Caper, MD is intellectually honest.
He also would like to see everyone in the US have universal health care and health care shouldn't be viewed as a commodity. All items I agree with.
ACA / Obamacare is no doubt a step in the right direction. Unlike Paul Ryan's plan that tried to take steps to privatize medicare and the main reason Romney lost the election. People in the US want some action in the way of reducing healthcare cost. If all insurance companies won't pay 10$ for individual soap, hospitals will stop overcharging insurance companies because they cannot collect on it. If more people are in the exchange, there will be less people receiving expensive care in the ER. The more people you have in the exchange the more the "law of large numbers" applies. Which simply means, random events can have some real long-term results that are predictable.
One of the biggest problems with Obamacare / ACA is what the supreme court did to it. The supreme court took out the clause that forces all states to expand their medicaid program. Now my tax dollars will go fund health insurance for people in NY because Rick Perry is an idiot.
For people wanting more info on how ObamaCare/ACA effects you in your state go here:
http://obamacarefacts.com/insurance-exc ... change.php" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
In Maine, where Dr. Philip Caper is from it appears their governor won't expand either. **ridiculous** It will likely be like the medicare roll out.
He also would like to see everyone in the US have universal health care and health care shouldn't be viewed as a commodity. All items I agree with.
ACA / Obamacare is no doubt a step in the right direction. Unlike Paul Ryan's plan that tried to take steps to privatize medicare and the main reason Romney lost the election. People in the US want some action in the way of reducing healthcare cost. If all insurance companies won't pay 10$ for individual soap, hospitals will stop overcharging insurance companies because they cannot collect on it. If more people are in the exchange, there will be less people receiving expensive care in the ER. The more people you have in the exchange the more the "law of large numbers" applies. Which simply means, random events can have some real long-term results that are predictable.
One of the biggest problems with Obamacare / ACA is what the supreme court did to it. The supreme court took out the clause that forces all states to expand their medicaid program. Now my tax dollars will go fund health insurance for people in NY because Rick Perry is an idiot.
For people wanting more info on how ObamaCare/ACA effects you in your state go here:
http://obamacarefacts.com/insurance-exc ... change.php" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
In Maine, where Dr. Philip Caper is from it appears their governor won't expand either. **ridiculous** It will likely be like the medicare roll out.
Re: Podcast 5 Obamacare why it sucks
Phys you might want to listen to the whole interview because I basically owned him showing how ACA is total shit and so is medicare for all if we dont do anything to lower the total cost of procedures and drugs which means we have to get rid of the protectionist regulations. And he agreed with me by the end. ACA is a step sideways not forward. I knew leftist would get suckered by the preview because he gave praise to Obama and Pelosi.
Shifting around how much is paid for by taxes vs out of pocket doesn't matter when the biggest problem is the total cost of the care. The total cost is high because medicare and fill in the blank is not able by law to negotiate the prices down because our bribed congress set it up that way. AKA the government fucked it up. Yes they were lobbied but guess what corporations don't have the power to enforce this without the arm of government. We can't wipe out corporations but we can change the laws and the government. We should even have insurance companies in the system and healthcare shouldn't even be a business. It ought to be single payer but not until there is a free market on the purchasing side be it the program you use or the individual or hospital (for equipment) to negotiate down the price from providers who have to compete with one another rather than being given regional monopolies. It doesn't matter what you offer the buyer once it has already reached the point of super expensive choice A or super expensive choice B.
The whole purpose of having a progressive on was so I could make that argument and have a Leftist Dr tell you the same thing which appeals to the leftist's sense of authoritarianism where they will listen to it if he says it but not if I say it.
https://ryliberty.squarespace.com/podcast" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Shifting around how much is paid for by taxes vs out of pocket doesn't matter when the biggest problem is the total cost of the care. The total cost is high because medicare and fill in the blank is not able by law to negotiate the prices down because our bribed congress set it up that way. AKA the government fucked it up. Yes they were lobbied but guess what corporations don't have the power to enforce this without the arm of government. We can't wipe out corporations but we can change the laws and the government. We should even have insurance companies in the system and healthcare shouldn't even be a business. It ought to be single payer but not until there is a free market on the purchasing side be it the program you use or the individual or hospital (for equipment) to negotiate down the price from providers who have to compete with one another rather than being given regional monopolies. It doesn't matter what you offer the buyer once it has already reached the point of super expensive choice A or super expensive choice B.
The whole purpose of having a progressive on was so I could make that argument and have a Leftist Dr tell you the same thing which appeals to the leftist's sense of authoritarianism where they will listen to it if he says it but not if I say it.
https://ryliberty.squarespace.com/podcast" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Get The Empire Unmasked here
Re: Podcast 5 Obamacare why it sucks
Ry, I tend to listen to a lot of what you post. Listening to something isnt the same as agreeing with it.
You're facts are off, again. Medicare does not negotiate price but they do deny coverage which is the loophole that 'medicare' has to help control cost.
I didn't really hear you owning anyone. I hear him being polite to you. We agree in the single payer and ACA/ObamaCare isnt single payer its moving steps into that direction without disrupting the entire system. The republican plan for health care --wait there is no plan except buying across state lines which I personally would love cause I could sell to anyone, but that would turn health care into an even bigger commodity and less of a value. Paul Ryan is the only one that offered any plan and it was just to turn medicare into private markets. We have done "medicare" as a private market. It doesnt work. ObamaCare/ACA actually sets standards for healthcare, expands medicaid for the poor, and provides subsidies for the middle class. Provided governs aren't idiots. Your state is another idiot state. All are great steps to single payer.
Did you understand the part 'the law of large numbers'? It doesnt really seem like you did in your response.
I invited you to 'own' me here: http://www.ancreport.com/forum/v ... 73#p192373" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
You're facts are off, again. Medicare does not negotiate price but they do deny coverage which is the loophole that 'medicare' has to help control cost.
I didn't really hear you owning anyone. I hear him being polite to you. We agree in the single payer and ACA/ObamaCare isnt single payer its moving steps into that direction without disrupting the entire system. The republican plan for health care --wait there is no plan except buying across state lines which I personally would love cause I could sell to anyone, but that would turn health care into an even bigger commodity and less of a value. Paul Ryan is the only one that offered any plan and it was just to turn medicare into private markets. We have done "medicare" as a private market. It doesnt work. ObamaCare/ACA actually sets standards for healthcare, expands medicaid for the poor, and provides subsidies for the middle class. Provided governs aren't idiots. Your state is another idiot state. All are great steps to single payer.
Did you understand the part 'the law of large numbers'? It doesnt really seem like you did in your response.
I invited you to 'own' me here: http://www.ancreport.com/forum/v ... 73#p192373" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Re: Podcast 5 Obamacare why it sucks
phys even if it covers all it will have the same problem it has now not being able to control the price. That's how you get hospital bills in the hundreds of thousands of dollars and they think fuck the government is paying so who cares. We have to get rid of protectionist regulations step one before anything else. All these other countries with some form of single payer care they ALL actively negotiate prices down between competitive markets.
He is wrong about the military industrial complex getting out spent 4 to 1. its not even remotely close. He said they spend 2 million a day in the medical industrial complex. lol that's 5 times less than just the 10 million a day sent to Israel 75% of which is earmarked to be spent back on US military gear. That's 7.5 million right there already 3 and a half times more than what big pharma lobbies with.
I left this guy alone on a lot of things because we have the same goal to get healthcare cost down. Had I not edited out part of the end he would look like a fool. I had to bite my tongue when he said his economist was married to the current Fed Chair as if that Gave it credibility. lol.
He goes down a path I bring up a point and hes says that's right. I asked him how it matters how much is paid in tax vs out of pocket if the total cost of care is not addressed and he agreed it wont. but then went on to medicare for all. Same problem still persist albeit about 5% less than private insurance for the medicare for all method. If they can't negotiate the prices down then it doesn't matter. Just raising taxes on everyone wont do anything but cause more unemployment and financial problems. We also need to reform the way patents are given to drugs who barely change themselves from their original composition just so the price can stay high.
He said governemnt is a wimp its corporations to blame and I pointed out that no its government because that is who prevents price negotiation and that corporations cant just "do whatever they want" without the arm and enforcement of government. And you hear him say well i dont know what the solution is then because he is psychologically unable to allow blame to be put on the government even after I clearly explained how the state has fucked everything up. At this point I cut him a break. You didn't hear all of it. And I said well i have you on more for your expertise in the medical side of it not economics. BUt you hear him admit he has no solution when we start talking about government vs corporations.
The solution is simple get rid of those protectionist regulations and corporations will be forced to negotiate prices. If the price is low enough as in the 50s people can pay out of pocket or with taxes and it doesn't matter because its not a financial burden.
He was clearly an obama nut hugger did you hear him say "I dont know someone must have made him say that" about Obama saying you wont have to change plans and yet you do. WTF how is this shocking Obama has lied about Everything he has ever promised. No one made him do it the man IS a liar.
He is wrong about the military industrial complex getting out spent 4 to 1. its not even remotely close. He said they spend 2 million a day in the medical industrial complex. lol that's 5 times less than just the 10 million a day sent to Israel 75% of which is earmarked to be spent back on US military gear. That's 7.5 million right there already 3 and a half times more than what big pharma lobbies with.
I left this guy alone on a lot of things because we have the same goal to get healthcare cost down. Had I not edited out part of the end he would look like a fool. I had to bite my tongue when he said his economist was married to the current Fed Chair as if that Gave it credibility. lol.
He goes down a path I bring up a point and hes says that's right. I asked him how it matters how much is paid in tax vs out of pocket if the total cost of care is not addressed and he agreed it wont. but then went on to medicare for all. Same problem still persist albeit about 5% less than private insurance for the medicare for all method. If they can't negotiate the prices down then it doesn't matter. Just raising taxes on everyone wont do anything but cause more unemployment and financial problems. We also need to reform the way patents are given to drugs who barely change themselves from their original composition just so the price can stay high.
He said governemnt is a wimp its corporations to blame and I pointed out that no its government because that is who prevents price negotiation and that corporations cant just "do whatever they want" without the arm and enforcement of government. And you hear him say well i dont know what the solution is then because he is psychologically unable to allow blame to be put on the government even after I clearly explained how the state has fucked everything up. At this point I cut him a break. You didn't hear all of it. And I said well i have you on more for your expertise in the medical side of it not economics. BUt you hear him admit he has no solution when we start talking about government vs corporations.
The solution is simple get rid of those protectionist regulations and corporations will be forced to negotiate prices. If the price is low enough as in the 50s people can pay out of pocket or with taxes and it doesn't matter because its not a financial burden.
He was clearly an obama nut hugger did you hear him say "I dont know someone must have made him say that" about Obama saying you wont have to change plans and yet you do. WTF how is this shocking Obama has lied about Everything he has ever promised. No one made him do it the man IS a liar.
Get The Empire Unmasked here
Re: Podcast 5 Obamacare why it sucks
That was a lot of fluff.
I will just respond to the part that is dealing with healthcare.
Where prices are growing the most in the US are drug prices. The US govt gives a free ride to drug companies. That's why many people buy their meds outside the US online. Pharmaceutical companies which is a corporation, has bought many in washington. They have even bought Obama.
Its the same for big banks, big oil and almost every industry in the US. The companies that make bombs, fighter planes, guns, ammo, nuclear weapons etc etc... are private contracting companies. That's why we have wars and conflicts.
I will just respond to the part that is dealing with healthcare.
I already addressed the issue of price negotiation. When you are talking about procedures, the govt will only pay X amount of $ US for those procedures. When your wife had her baby, the govt would only pay your doctor x amount of dollars per visit and delivery. X amount of dollars for sonogram. The govt also limits the number. You are only allowed procedures that are reasonable and customary for whatever problems you are having. The govt actively negotiating prices on visits, procedures, and equipment through denial of coverage. Dr. Y CANNOT charge whatever he wants because the govt is paying.phys even if it covers all it will have the same problem it has now not being able to control the price. That's how you get hospital bills in the hundreds of thousands of dollars and they think fuck the government is paying so who cares. We have to get rid of protectionist regulations step one before anything else. All these other countries with some form of single payer care they ALL actively negotiate prices down between competitive markets.
Where prices are growing the most in the US are drug prices. The US govt gives a free ride to drug companies. That's why many people buy their meds outside the US online. Pharmaceutical companies which is a corporation, has bought many in washington. They have even bought Obama.
Continuing on the theme Pharmaceutical corporations, Big Pharm isn't worried about "the arm of enforcement" because the arm of enforcement comes in the way of a dollar amount fine. Look up how much pharmaceutical corporations have paid in fines for the last few years, close to 45 billion $US, that's billions with a B. That's just a bump in the road. Big Pharm can do whatever it wants because the price of breaking the law if they get caught, is something the corporations can live with.He said governemnt is a wimp its corporations to blame and I pointed out that no its government because that is who prevents price negotiation and that corporations cant just "do whatever they want" without the arm and enforcement of government.
Its the same for big banks, big oil and almost every industry in the US. The companies that make bombs, fighter planes, guns, ammo, nuclear weapons etc etc... are private contracting companies. That's why we have wars and conflicts.
I already addressed all of that above.The solution is simple get rid of those protectionist regulations and corporations will be forced to negotiate prices. If the price is low enough as in the 50s people can pay out of pocket or with taxes and it doesn't matter because its not a financial burden.
Re: Podcast 5 Obamacare why it sucks
phys i could just cut and paste what I already said.
The X amount is a very high amount because they are NOT negotiating prices and they are not doing that because the government made regulations against it. That's what they ACTUALLY do not what you think they ought to do.
They were paying 1,000 dollars for a sonogram. Now I didn't have to pay it medicaid did. But why was something that is 30 dollar or less in other countries cost a thousand in the US even if it is tax money paying for it? Because they DON'T NEGOTIATE THE PRICE DOWN BECAUSE THEY CANT and have no incentive to do so.
This is not that complicate I dont know why or how you can be so dense about this.
Do you not understand that the x amount government agrees to pay is still extremely high because the government is spending other people's money. And because madicare as we said on the program cannot by law negotiate down the prices of drugs from big pharma. There are similar regulations on medical equipment and the rest of it. We would need to get rid of those regulation and create regulations on maximum prices. AND get rid of the insurance system all together.
The X amount is a very high amount because they are NOT negotiating prices and they are not doing that because the government made regulations against it. That's what they ACTUALLY do not what you think they ought to do.
They were paying 1,000 dollars for a sonogram. Now I didn't have to pay it medicaid did. But why was something that is 30 dollar or less in other countries cost a thousand in the US even if it is tax money paying for it? Because they DON'T NEGOTIATE THE PRICE DOWN BECAUSE THEY CANT and have no incentive to do so.
This is not that complicate I dont know why or how you can be so dense about this.
Do you not understand that the x amount government agrees to pay is still extremely high because the government is spending other people's money. And because madicare as we said on the program cannot by law negotiate down the prices of drugs from big pharma. There are similar regulations on medical equipment and the rest of it. We would need to get rid of those regulation and create regulations on maximum prices. AND get rid of the insurance system all together.
Get The Empire Unmasked here
Re: Podcast 5 Obamacare why it sucks
You have copied and pasted that several times. It still doesn't refute anything I just posted.
Bringing more people into the marketplace allows for procedural cost to go down.
Insurance regulations and standards in ACA/ObamaCare helps to set-up best practises and REASONABLE AND CUSTOMARY rates.
You cannot allow your blind hatred for anything "Obama" to get in the way of something that is actually a step in the right directions. The amount stuff cost is the problem. It's the problem ACA addresses minus drug cost.
Once again, you do not seem to understand the "law of large numbers".
Insurance is my profession Ry. You may want to stick to geopolitics and back away from this health care debate. Universal health care does lower cost. That's why its good we are moving toward single payer.
So please read slowly and thoughtfully, without your ego being hurt that you clearly do not understand then logically take in what Im telling you.
I already addressed the issue of price negotiation. When you are talking about procedures, the govt will only pay X amount of $ US for those procedures. When your wife had her baby, the govt would only pay your doctor x amount of dollars per visit and delivery. X amount of dollars for sonogram. The govt also limits the number. You are only allowed procedures that are reasonable and customary for whatever problems you are having. The govt actively negotiating prices on visits, procedures, and equipment through denial of coverage. Dr. Y CANNOT charge whatever he wants because the govt is paying.
Where prices are growing the most in the US are drug prices. The US govt gives a free ride to drug companies. That's why many people buy their meds outside the US online. Pharmaceutical companies which is a corporation, has bought many in washington. They have even bought Obama.
Continuing on the theme Pharmaceutical corporations, Big Pharm isn't worried about "the arm of enforcement" because the arm of enforcement comes in the way of a dollar amount fine. Look up how much pharmaceutical corporations have paid in fines for the last few years, close to 45 billion $US, that's billions with a B. That's just a bump in the road. Big Pharm can do whatever it wants because the price of breaking the law if they get caught, is something the corporations can live with.
Its the same for big banks, big oil and almost every industry in the US. The companies that make bombs, fighter planes, guns, ammo, nuclear weapons etc etc... are private contracting companies. That's why we have wars and conflicts.
Continuing with your sonogram hypothetical example, the hospital may have charged medicaid 1000$ but medicaid only paid 600$. Each hospital has the right to charge whatever, but the govt also has the right to pay what is reasonable and customary.
Have you never had a vehicle insurance claim? homeowners claim? private health insurance claim? grandparent on medicare?
You didn't actually see the amount the govt paid the hospital because the govt pays them directly. Medicaid only gets info from you to see if you qualify.
Bringing more people into the marketplace allows for procedural cost to go down.
Insurance regulations and standards in ACA/ObamaCare helps to set-up best practises and REASONABLE AND CUSTOMARY rates.
You cannot allow your blind hatred for anything "Obama" to get in the way of something that is actually a step in the right directions. The amount stuff cost is the problem. It's the problem ACA addresses minus drug cost.
Once again, you do not seem to understand the "law of large numbers".
Insurance is my profession Ry. You may want to stick to geopolitics and back away from this health care debate. Universal health care does lower cost. That's why its good we are moving toward single payer.
So please read slowly and thoughtfully, without your ego being hurt that you clearly do not understand then logically take in what Im telling you.
I already addressed the issue of price negotiation. When you are talking about procedures, the govt will only pay X amount of $ US for those procedures. When your wife had her baby, the govt would only pay your doctor x amount of dollars per visit and delivery. X amount of dollars for sonogram. The govt also limits the number. You are only allowed procedures that are reasonable and customary for whatever problems you are having. The govt actively negotiating prices on visits, procedures, and equipment through denial of coverage. Dr. Y CANNOT charge whatever he wants because the govt is paying.
Where prices are growing the most in the US are drug prices. The US govt gives a free ride to drug companies. That's why many people buy their meds outside the US online. Pharmaceutical companies which is a corporation, has bought many in washington. They have even bought Obama.
Continuing on the theme Pharmaceutical corporations, Big Pharm isn't worried about "the arm of enforcement" because the arm of enforcement comes in the way of a dollar amount fine. Look up how much pharmaceutical corporations have paid in fines for the last few years, close to 45 billion $US, that's billions with a B. That's just a bump in the road. Big Pharm can do whatever it wants because the price of breaking the law if they get caught, is something the corporations can live with.
Its the same for big banks, big oil and almost every industry in the US. The companies that make bombs, fighter planes, guns, ammo, nuclear weapons etc etc... are private contracting companies. That's why we have wars and conflicts.
Continuing with your sonogram hypothetical example, the hospital may have charged medicaid 1000$ but medicaid only paid 600$. Each hospital has the right to charge whatever, but the govt also has the right to pay what is reasonable and customary.
Have you never had a vehicle insurance claim? homeowners claim? private health insurance claim? grandparent on medicare?
You didn't actually see the amount the govt paid the hospital because the govt pays them directly. Medicaid only gets info from you to see if you qualify.
Re: Podcast 5 Obamacare why it sucks
Obama care is the solution to a manufactured problem herded from societal reaction. The philanthropy it currently will do is not worth giving govt more centralized power.
Were in a mafioso system and what it does is lie. Bait and switch? Everything is compartmentalized so you can manufacture agenda and cover your tracks.
We keep giving into concessions over concessions and concessions.
Were in a mafioso system and what it does is lie. Bait and switch? Everything is compartmentalized so you can manufacture agenda and cover your tracks.
We keep giving into concessions over concessions and concessions.
Last edited by Zardoz on Thu Nov 07, 2013 2:49 am, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Podcast 5 Obamacare why it sucks
Yes it does Jill. You aren't acknowledging the reason the prices are as high as they are. And you don't understand economics. I live in a country with working universal Healthcare. I have experienced both sides. Start your own podcast and radio and youtube if you know so much. You don't know shit. You're ignoring WHY healthcare is so expensive.
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